Anti-Flag

One of the most anticipated concerts of the past couple months was this one, Billy Talent, Rise Against, Anti-Flag and Moneen. It was at Rexall Place, the same place where the Oilers play, and a few hours before Anti-Flag took the stage Pat Thetic was nice enough to sit and answer some questions as the Sharks and Oilers wandered around in preparation for the next day’s game. The interview went really well, Pat was once again a great guy and didn’t hold back on any of his answers. If you have a chance to check these guys out live, do it, you won’t be disappointed. Thanks to Pat for doing it and to Joanne for setting it up.

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Bobby: Starting with the basics, you guys have been on tour with Billy Talent, Rise Against and Moneen for a couple days now; how’s that going so far?

Pat: So far it’s been going great. The Billy Talent, Rise Against dudes are very nice. Moneen is a good band. So yeah, it’s been going great.

Bobby: Has there been any really memorable moments so far? I know I was reading that Number 2 and Jon were playing hockey the other day in Vancouver.

Pat: Umm… memorable moments for me… Have we had any memorable moments on tour yet Tito? *The tour manager, Tito, walks by and scoffs jokingly at the question* Tito says no.

*We find a new place to do the interview to get away from someone testing out their drums right behind us*

So, memorable moments; there hasn’t been any memorable moments but today I’m looking forward to the [West] Edmonton Mall. We’re going out to the mall and last time we were there they had a sea lion show and I’m looking forward to check out the sea lion show again.

Bobby: Did you see the flamingos there last time?

Pat: I didn’t see the flamingos. We were only there last year or the year before, I don’t remember what they had. I heard they had dolphins and then one of them died and it was all bad. It’s probably very unethical to have animals in the mall, but I enjoyed it.

Bobby: This is of course a stadium tour. How different is it playing at hockey arenas, coliseum compared to playing at places like Red’s in the mall where you played last time?

Pat: It’s not really that different because you can only see the first three rows of kids whether you play here or whether you play at the smaller places. So it’s not that much different. Obviously there’s a shower after every show, which is nice, if you play a big room. And yeah, so I guess there are differences but for me, when I’m playing, it’s the same show for me whether I’m in a big room or in a small room.

Bobby: You guys were the first band to announce that you guys were going to do the Punk Goes Acoustic Volume Two compilation. What made you decide to do this compilation?

Pat: We were asked. *laughs* I don’t know, I don’t really have a whole lot to answer for that. Other people have asked us that, is that a big deal? I don’t know. They called us, said “you wanna do it?” and “alright, I guess we’ll do it.”

Bobby: Any idea what song you’re gonna do? A new one or a old one or what?

Pat: *Catching #2 as he walks by* What are we putting on Punk Goes Acoustic?

#2: It’s still up in the air.

Pat: It’s still up in the air, we don’t know yet.

#2: There’s talk about doing a new one, but then there’s talk about saving the new songs for the record.

Pat: We actually have a bunch of acoustic songs that we’ve recorded, we have our own recording equipment at home and we just record stuff. So we actually have some acoustic songs that we recorded years and years ago.

Bobby: Like 1984 and Protest and stuff like that?

Pat: Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Older stuff like that.

Bobby: Set Your Goals was the second band to be confirmed for the compilation and of course you’re touring with them next with the War Sucks, Let’s Party Tour with Alexisonfire and Big D & The Kids Table. Are you excited for that tour?

Pat: That tour’s gonna be great. We’re gonna be in the States with that tour and it’s going to be our headlining tour and we’re going to be able to play more than thirty minutes, which will be nice. We haven’t played for a long period of time for a while. And yeah, it’s gonna be good. We get home from this tour, have a couple weeks off. Do a little work at home, do a little practicing, work on some new songs, and then come back out on tour again.

Bobby: A portion of all the pre-sales for that went to the African Well Fund which helps keep drinking water safe and make wells in Africa. What made you pick that charity for the pre-sale?

Pat: We’re always looking for other ways of making our connection, not just our connection with other people but our connection in the band to be about more than just music and something more than just getting together and having a good time. ‘Cause we feel there is such amazing energy that is created through punk rock and through activism. Let’s not waste that. We feel that the shows are an example of that, so we put together the African Well Fund thing to be a part of that. We chose them because we thought that it’s amazing for such a small amount of money you can have such a major impact on people’s lives. In us doing it with the rock show it also advertises that this is going on and gives other people the idea that “hey, for a couple hundred bucks that my friends and I can put together, we can put a well in Africa so people can drink.” It’s one of the most basic elements. You can’t have peace; you can’t have a healthy life unless you have water. It’s a basic need that you need to have. You have to take care of it before you can have justice, peace, happiness and all the other things.

Bobby: That, of course, isn’t the only charity you work with. You work with PETA, Military Free Zone, Music for America, The World Can’t Wait and more. This tour you’re working with West 49 to do signings, meet and greets and get sweaters and blankets for the local youth shelters.

Pat: Yep. Local youth shelters. In every city across Canada we do an event at the West 49 and hopefully people bring in sweaters and jackets and we donate them to the youth shelters. That’s fun. It’s good, and again, it’s the same type of thing were we’re trying to make it into something more than just hanging out and talking to people. There’s an event going on, it’s something where people can help each other.

Bobby: Do you think that’s an important part of the punk community, to give back, to help support and work with charities?

Pat: I don’t see it like that. People have asked us about that, they’re like “wow, because you’re successful you feel as though you need to give back?” That’s not it. A, I don’t think I’m that successful but B, it’s not a question of giving back because I’ve been given to, it’s a question of this is our world. There’s people around us, we need to take care of these people. And then, ultimately, it’s not a purely altruistic thing. The more you give out, I’m a firm believer, the more comes back to you. It’s a bit hippy, a bit lovey dovey and shit like that, but I do believe the more we help each other, the more us, individually, are helped as well.

Bobby: During the tour in support of Blood &Empire you worked closely with Amnesty International to help get Helen Berhane out of Eritrea who had been imprisoned for her religious beliefs. How did it feel to be able to make such a big impact? To get her out?

Pat: Exactly. It’s amazing because in our world, as leftist activists, there’s so few battles that you win. And when you actually get somebody out and you actually have something that actually wins, it’s an amazing feeling. It’s a similar thing with Jim McDermott finally getting the law passed about depleted uranium and getting a studying done on it. That was an amazing win and we never thought we’d get that. So it gives you hope to continue to fight and to know that you can win some of these battles. They’re not just battles that you’ll never be able to win.

Bobby: Yesterday you guys posted on your website about a site called DefendThePress.org where they’re trying to get reporter Sarah Olson out of a subpoena to testify against First Lieutenant Ehren Watada. Can you tell us a bit about that?

Pat: Well all I know is what is in the article that we put on the website. Somebody had sent it to me and said “this is an important thing, check it out.” I looked it over and thought “yeah it is.” It is a good thing. ‘Cause I’m a firm believer in whistle blowers. I believe whistle blowers are the backbone of democracy, just like the media. We need people who are inside, who have the information, such as the military personal who are going to say “you know what, this is crap. I’m not going to do this. This goes against everything that I believe in. Against the foundation of our country and what we’re fighting for.” Just so that people know, he [Ehren Watada] refused to go back and fight in Iraq and is being court marshaled for it. People who are whistle blowers and people who the whistle blowers talk to, like the press, need to be protected. Because they’re not doing it for their own benefit, they’re doing it because it’s something they believe in, for the benefit of all of us. And I think those people need to be protected. And specifically within that, the press, I think, should be protected at all cost. Because if you don’t have a free press and the government can and the military can intimidate the press, we don’t have a free press and then our democracy goes down the tube.

Bobby: Yeah, then there would all be biased reporting.

Pat: Exactly.

Bobby: And you’ll have no idea what to believe anymore.

Pat: Well, you already don’t. We already don’t know what to believe anymore and it’s just getting worse and worse by the day.

Bobby: Okay, let’s talk a bit about your first major label release, For Blood And Empire. First, you’ve already released three video singles from it. Trillion Dollars, War Sucks, Let’s Party and This Is The End.

Pat: Yep. And The Press Corpse.

Bobby: Oh really? I missed that video.

Pat: Oh well, it’s not that good.

Bobby: Four videos then. Why did you pick four videos and released them so soon?

Pat: Umm… that’s a good question; I don’t know why we did it. Some of them we created ourselves because we thought… Like for War Sucks, Let’s Party, we thought it was just an amazing thing to release, somebody helped us create that one. One Trillion Dollars, we thought that song was helped by the video and it gives a little bit more life, it gives people another chance to understand what’s going on in the song. Those ones we did for our own personal [reasons], we thought it was cool. The other ones, for This Is The End and The Press Corpse, are the ones that we did because those are the songs that are going to be the focus of the record. So we wanted people to know about them. We tried to make bold statements in both of them and I’m proud of the statements we made. They didn’t come off as well as I had like them to have. But there’s still statements in there that are strong.

Bobby: Oh definitely. On the album you guys tried a few different things, like the slowed down acoustic One Trillion Dollars. What I found most surprising was the addition of the trumpets during Hymn For The Dead, which fit the song perfectly but was incredibly surprising to hear on an Anti-Flag record.

Pat: It’s funny that everyone was so surprised by that. It just made sense to us to do it that way. It’s funny but it’s interesting that people who have listened to the record are just like “I can’t believe you did that.” We didn’t think about it like it was going to be that groundbreaking of a thing. It was just like “ah, it would be neat if we put trumpets in.” “Alright, that’s cool.” There’s actually a lot of other things in the record that we were going to try and do but we just ran out of time and didn’t have the resources to make it happen.

Bobby: Like what?

Pat: Just like trumpets and strings and different types of musical textures to put into the songs to give them a little bit more dynamic. Hopefully by the next record we’ll be able to get some of that stuff in.

Bobby: Like you said before, you guys worked with Congressman Jim McDermott on the final track Depleted Uranium Is A War Crime. How did you first get in contact with McDermott?

Pat: We met him first when we were doing PunkVoter. He was helping us out with PunkVoter. We did a bunch of events on the PunkVoter tour and I guess that was fall of 2003, fall of 2004, I don’t remember when it was. He did a bunch of events, speaking events, with us and we just got to meet him and found that he was just such a good standing guy and cared about the issues that we cared about and had the power to really make change. He, I think, saw in us a chance to reach out to younger people who aren’t as involved in the political game that he’s involved in. I think we both compliment each other. He has the power to actually enact change and we have access to some people that he doesn’t have access to.

Bobby: In 2006, For Blood And Empire was the number one top selling album on Interpunk.com.

Pat: That’s what I hear.

Bobby: It beat out Brand New, NOFX, Taking Back Sunday, Bouncing Souls all that. How does it feel to be number one on Interpunk?

Pat: *laughs* That’s a funny question. We have a record company, A-F Records, and we’ve been working with Interpunk since the very – I don’t think it was the beginning of Interpunk but it was very early on in Interpunk and I remember meeting with Bob, the owner of Interpunk, at a rock show. He came up and just said “hi, I’m Bob. I do Interpunk.” And I was like “hey Bob!” He was just a nice guy. So we’ve had a relationship with Interpunk for a long time so it’s nice to be able to be successful in a place where you feel comfortable and you like the people who are there. And they do a good job, Interpunk does. They have a lot of records for people to get access to.

Bobby: Some you can’t always find in stores.

Pat: Exactly, I think that Interpunk serves a great function and they’ve been successful with it. So yeah, it’s a good time to be there. *laughs*

Bobby: Focusing on the music aspect of you guys, a lot of your songs are sing-along anthems. Do you think for singing political activist songs it is important to have people scream the words, sing the words back at you with the song? Create a sort of unity?

Pat: A, that’s the kind of music that we love to create. We love to create it because we love to listen to it; music that people can become a part of. So that’s the kind of music that we love and the kind of music that we try to create, sometimes we’re more successful than others. But to have an impact in an activist way with music, you have to make sure that people can identify with your music. Again, those are all the elements that we try to put together when we write songs. Like I said, sometimes we’re more successful than others. But I love to be at a show and to be singing along with the band and with everybody else at the show. It’s a great time, whether I’m in the crowd or whether I’m on stage – you know, wherever.

Bobby: Last time you guys were in Edmonton, in the second or third song you guys all dropped your instruments…

Pat: Yeah, yeah, we almost got beat up that night.

Bobby: Yeah, there was a fan being attacked by security. Do you guys do that a lot? Do you think it’s important for bands to protect their fans?

Pat: *laughs* We do it more than we probably should. Security guards are big, scary dudes and often times their on a hair trigger and want to beat our asses. So yeah, we do it more than we should. But at the same time, like I said, from being in the crowd singing along to being on stage singing along, I don’t see the difference. Because some days I’m in the crowd at a show at home, or at a show wherever I am, and some days I’m on stage. So, when you look down and you see some goon security guard fucking up some kid you think “wait a minute – that could be me. That could be my friends.” It doesn’t have to be like that. So, yeah, we always try to stop and make sure… Because ultimately, the people who are important to us are the people who are there to see us and be a part of it, the security guards are less important to us. Obviously, we don’t want to see anybody getting hurt but we want to give the people who are there to be a part of our experience as much freedom to be there as possible.

Bobby: But at the same time you have to thank the security sometimes. I was reading a book by Tripp Underwood from the Unseen – his new book, So This Is Readin’.

Pat: Tripp’s a cynical bastard though. I love Tripp, but he’s a cynical. But go ahead, tell me what Tripp said.

Bobby: He was talking about an old venue in New Jersey called The Pipeline.

Pat: Oh! The Pipeline, yes!

Bobby: And a bouncer there called Junior and how Oi!s and skinheads would go there to pick fights with punks. One time, there were these skinheads running after Justin Sane. So Junior protected him. Loaded your stuff; carried him over his shoulder and put him in the van.

Pat: And that’s true. But that’s when you have security guards that are from the community. And that’s the best way to be – when you have the security guards who are the kids who are at the shows. Some days they are the security guards, some days they’re just watching the show. The people who understand what’s going on, I agree, in that situation, I trust them to make the right decision on what they should do. At Red’s, they were goons there that were football players who just happened to get paid to be security at a punk rock show and weren’t part of the community and at that point, those people are not necessarily my friends.

Bobby: You’ll be happy to know that in June of last year Red’s shut down and it re-opened as Edmonton Events Centre with some of the same security but some new security; and it’s so much better. I’ve only been like two or three times, but already I can tell it’s just much better.

Pat: Well that’s great. A lot of responsible club owners realize that the security is there to protect the crowd that’s there and if they understand that, it’s always good. But if they think that they’re there to show everybody how tough they are and how they can beat up the little skinhead punk rock kid, that’s not helping anybody.

Bobby: Tripp was also saying that skinheads would go to fight with the punks. Do you think that being in a leftist, activist, out-spoken band called Anti-Flag you guys were faced with more people following blind patriotism, calling you anti-patriotic, anti-American?

Pat: Oh yeah, for sure. When we were young, there were a lot of shows where we were like “fuck, we need to get out of here and we need somebody to help us get out of here because we’re gonna get our asses beat.” So there were some sketchy shows, and there’s still some sketchy shows, but at this point in our lives, people understand what we’re about and understand how we conduct ourselves. So if they agree to do a show with us, they know what they’re getting involved in.

Bobby: It’s also probably more open-minded now. Like there are people who talk out against the Bush regime.

Pat: Yeah, for sure. In the mid-nineties when we were talking about these issues, people weren’t less aware. Now they’re a little bit more aware of them, whether they agree with them, they still want to beat our asses for saying it, but they’re a little bit more aware of it.

Bobby: I’m currently incredibly interested in the old punk scene, late eighties and early nineties. How different do you think it is between then and like now?

Pat: You see this is the thing; I don’t know whether it really has changed. My perspective has changed, but I don’t think it really has changed. Because I think in every city, there’s still a group of like twenty or thirty kids who are creating music in their own way. Just like we did in the late eighties, early nineties, they’re like “we don’t need clubs, we don’t need record companies, we don’t need anything. All we need is us, some cheap Xerox flyers and our gear.” I think that there’s still kids who are doing that now. I don’t have access to them as much as I did then obviously, because we were creating it, we were in the middle of it. But I think it’s still going on. I think times have changed, the style of music have changed, there’s different cultural things that are going on, but there’s still those groups of kids in every city in the country who are trying to create music that makes sense to them and the people that are directly around them.

Bobby: Lastly, I’m currently doing a research at school about the effect MP3s have on CD sales and touring bands. Does it help them? Does it hurt them? What do you think about that, the whole MP3 revolution?

Pat: Well, we have a record company, and our record company is doing horrible. Whether it’s because of MP3s or whether it’s because kids are less interested in what we’re doing right now or what. I don’t blame it on MP3s, I blame it on the inability of people who create music to figure out how to make young people interested in your music. Everybody’s like “ahh kids are stealing music.” Well, kids have been stealing music forever, and if you can’t figure out a way to A, make people want to compensate you for what you’re doing or B, figure out a way to make it so interesting that kids want to be a part of it or find other ways of making them a part of it. I think it’s the fault of the record industry and the people who are running it, more than it is the MP3s. They’re just not creative enough to find other solutions, and it’s only a matter of time before somebody will. But having said that, there is a definite effect that MP3s have had on the way people listen to music and how artists are able to make a living doing what they’re doing.