Northern State

Despite some preconceived notions contrary to the fact, punks can be moderately open minded. While yes, there is a preferred sound and style that we like to attach ourselves to, most are able to look beyond that and take a chance on a different sound. That’s why labels like Epitaph are signing acts like Sage Francis, Atmosphere, The Coup and Cadence Weapon; and that’s why I had no problem sitting down with New York’s all girl hip-hop/rap group Northern State before the hit the stage opening up for Tegan & Sara. Thanks to Spero for taking the time to talk to me and Melanie for setting it up.

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Bobby: I guess, starting with the basics, you guys have been on this tour with Tegan & Sara for almost a week now, how’s that going so far?

Spero: It’s going so great. We’re having so much fun. We have played with them for a few weeks in the US before so we kind of knew what to expect but it’s going even better than we thought. We love their audience, we love them. It seems to be a bill that really works even though we’re really different from them. We do more hip-hop stuff. They seem to think it works and we agree. We’re just having fun. It’s also fun to tour with other girls, we really enjoy that.

Bobby: That was one of my next questions; you guys are pretty different compared to Tegan & Sara, more energetic, more of a hip-hop style. How has the reception been from the Tegan & Sara fans?

Spero: It’s different in Canada than in the US, because in the US more people have heard of us. So in the US, right when we take the stage there’s a little bit more of a reaction. I think here in Canada, so far in the last week, some people have heard of us, some people are already fans and we hear them cheering – and we love them. I think the rest of the people seem to stare a little bit for the first few songs because they’re just kind of surprised I think; first of all to see girls rapping and then secondly to see girls rapping at a Tegan & Sara show. They’re just not expecting it. But the audiences have been really polite and really welcoming and as the set goes on they get more and more into it. We feel like we’re really wining over a lot of new fans which is exactly what you want on a tour like this. So it seems to be working but we definitely see them kind of looking at us for the beginning of the set with question marks in their eyes.

Bobby: I’ve seen pictures of you guys live and you seem to be pretty energetic, jumping around and running around. A lot of these shows are at auditoriums and more sit down venues, is it weird putting all this energy into your show, running around, when everyone else is just sitting down, calmly watching you guys?

Spero: That’s a really great question because that’s exactly one of the things we’ve been coming up against on the tour, and also on some other tours. We’ve toured with Cake once and they did some seated auditoriums as well and that’s very hard for us because we put a lot of energy into what we’re doing on stage and it doesn’t always feel so great if we don’t feel it coming back at us because people are sitting or whatever. But we’re just trying to go with it and we’re just happy to have that many people in the room watching us; and if they’re gonna watch us seated, then that’s fine. We obviously always love it if people get up off their seat. What’s funny about the seated shows is that there’s always a few crazy fans who are up front, in the aisle and it just makes us love those people even more than ever because they don’t care and they’re just gonna dance and do their thing, it’s awesome.

Bobby: In August, you guys released your fourth album, “Can I Keep This Pen?,” and it was a return to the independents being released on Ipecac instead of Columbia. Was it nice to be able to return to the independents?

Spero: Oh my gosh, it’s great. It really was, I think it was one of the best decisions we’ve ever made. W tried out the major label thing, we had an offer to be on a major label and we thought “well, let’s give it a try.” You never know, a lot of bands in our position would jump at that chance so we said we’re gonna try it. But it really wasn’t for us, it just wasn’t a world that we were comfortable in. Columbia really didn’t support our last album, “All City.” They didn’t work on it, they barely released it. It was hard for our fans to even find it, let alone new people to hear about it. It just did not work out. So we left them and we made the new record, “Can I Keep This Pen?,” totally independently. We financed it ourselves. We worked with Adrock from the Beastie Boys and Chuck Brody, both of them signed on to do the album with us when we didn’t have a label, we had hardly any money – they were not doing it for the money, I promise you. So we just felt so excited that they both wanted to work on it and we thought “you know what? If these guys want to do it, let’s just do it and we’ll figure out the rest later.” First we recorded the album and then we got in touch with Ipecac which is Mike Patton’s label. Do you know Mike Patton? He was in Faith No More back in the nineties and he has his own solo career now. He’s got actually this really cool kind of cult following and this really successful indie label so it turned out he was kind of a fan of ours and they wanted to put out the record. It’s great though, they work so hard for us. They’re a small label, they have a staff of about five people and yet they’re able to do more working with us then the entire staff of Columbia Records could ever do; so we feel really happy about working with them.

Bobby: Like you just said you were working with Adrock and Chuck Brody, what was it like working with those guys and how did you get in touch with them?

Spero: Chuck Brody, he also worked on our last album – “All City” – on a couple songs and we really wanted to work with him more. So when we decided we were gonna make a new album he was one of the first people we thought of. He’s also in a group called Shitake Monkey and they do production of a lot of great bands and they also have their own record which is great so we knew we just really wanted to work with him. And Adrock, we met when we opened up for Le Tigre several years ago and he was so friendly to us and was so supportive and just really, really awesome, like really went out of his way to be friendly to us. We always kind of wondered, because of a lot of people compare us to the Beastie Boys so we’ve always kind of wondered “do the Beastie Boys know who we are? Have they heard of us?” And he had, so our next question was “do they like us? Or do they not like us?” So we were so relieved when we met him, he was so nice to us and he said he really liked our music so we kind of just struck up our friendship that way. Then we played a festival with the Beastie Boys a few years later, they were headlining, we were on the other stage and he came and watched out set from the side. He rode a golf cart over to our stage to watch our set and then afterwards gave us passes to come on to their stage for their set and we kind of developed a friendship. He did a remix for us of one of our songs from the last record. Columbia didn’t use the remix for anything which is ridiculous, so then we asked him “well, they’re not gonna use the remix, but would you like to work on some new songs?” and he said absolutely. It was just awesome. He’s such a chill guy, so friendly, so easy going, and so easy to deal with. As successful as the Beastie Boys are, he doesn’t have any handlers or people that you have to go through to get to him. Everything we did with him, we scheduled it directly with him over e-mails and text and stuff. He’s so accessible and easy going and he really brought a lot. I mean, they both brought so much. Chuck Brody is an amazing producer and he did the bulk of the record, Adrock just did two songs. But Chuck, he can go between rock, hip-hop and pop really easily and that’s really hard to find. He’s worked with like Yoko Ono but also with Jennifer Lopez – he’s done everything. Adrock, I think, just really encouraged us to have fun and to make each other laugh and whatever was making each other laugh, just record that and not really worry about what anybody else would think. Just make sure it was something that we’d like in the room, in the studio, that we were all laughing at, that we all thought was fun. That was good enough. We tend to over think things and he was like “don’t even waste your time. You already have it. It’s already done. You already like it, just lay it down, let’s move on. Just do it.” That was really awesome, he’s very spontaneous so it was a great energy that he brought.

Bobby: You said earlier that a lot of people compare you to the Beastie Boys; do you think that is an accurate comparison?

Spero: I think so, sure; they’re a huge influence on us, absolutely. We listened to them growing up, we’re all big fans. I do think it’s accurate. I think that, like the Beastie Boys, one of the biggest similarities to them is that we blend a lot of different sounds together, rock and pop, even a little reggae on this album which I’m excited about. There are a lot of other influences too and I think those are harder for people to hear, but for sure, they’re such a huge influence on us. We find that comparison flattering; we think they’re one of the best bands ever.

Bobby: A lot of people, when they split ways with a major label they have a lot of problems getting out of the contract. Did you have much problems leaving Columbia?

Spero: We didn’t have such a big problem getting out of the contract. We have really great lawyers and also I don’t think they were dying to keep us. It just wasn’t a great relationship on either side; they just didn’t really care about our album and weren’t putting a lot of energy into us. So I don’t think it really mattered. If we were Mariah Carey trying to get out of contract, that would be hard; but they were just more like “whatever.” So that was fine, that wasn’t really the issue. I think it was more the part leading up to it where we were still trying to make that album a success and still trying to get them to focus some attention on it and still trying to get them to do what we needed them to do. That was the hard part. Once we finally made the decision that this was not working out, we’re leaving, it got easier from there.

Bobby: The hip-hop scene is predominantly male, people growing up in the suburbs, getting street cred and showing off their bling. You guys are vastly different being three college educated women from the suburbs of New York. How hard is it to break into that scene?

Spero: You know what; I don’t think we’ve ever really been a very urban hip-hop group. Kids in the inner city are not listening to Northern State, and that’s fine, that’s not really who we’re targeting. That’s not our experience so we’re not talking about those things. But I do think we’ve gotten a lot of support from the more old-school hip-hop community. Like Chuck D from Public Enemy is a friend of ours who we’re in touch with, he’s really, really supportive of us. He’s awesome. Pete Rock we worked with on our last album. Muggs from Cypress Hill, ?uestlove from the Roots, like all of these guys over the years have gotten in touch with us or vice versa and we’ve gotten in touch with them. They’ve responded really positively and it’s made us feel like we are a part of hip-hop. We’re not a part of the 50-Cent scene, we’re not what’s being played on hip-hop radio right now but we do feel like there is a place for us in the hip-hop community because we’ve been embraced so nicely from some of those guys and we really appreciate that.

Bobby: Lyrically you aren’t the normal hip-hop offering either. You talk more about literary references; you even rhyme in Spanish on a few songs…

Spero: Yes! We do, thank you for noticing.

Bobby: Is it weird getting this juxtaposition between this fun, energetic beat and these intelligent lyrics? Do you get weird reactions for that?

Spero: I think so. I think some of the all ages shows that we’ve been playing, when we drop some of those references we notice some of the younger kids are like… *Sara from Tegan & Sara runs up to the table* Hey you! Come here.

Sara: You have to sign this. “I promise to come to the water park or else!”

Spero: *laughs* I don’t have to sign that, I’m so there. *Signing the paper* C.M. Spero. Do you want collateral? Should I give you my cell phone or?

Sara: Nope, nope, this is good enough. I’ve got all three signatures.

Spero: *Looking at the contract she just signed* Wait! The water park?!? I thought it was the mall!

Sara: No! *laughs and runs away*

Spero: Nooooo! I wasn’t thinking clearly! I was just in the middle of an interview, it’s not fair.

Sara: *From the merch table* Too bad, you’re going!

Spero: Sara! She just conned me! Speaking of “The Con,” now I know where the name came from. Ahh, those Bitches. *Yelling at the table* I’m gonna have to talk to you bitches later. *Turns back to me* Okay, sorry.

Bobby: So I’m guessing you don’t like the water park?

Spero: I don’t want to be in my bikini. *Yelling back to Sara* I need you to promise me that you’ll buy me a new bathing suit that my you-know-whats don’t fall out off.

Sara: We can all wear t-shirts over our bathing suits like we were fifteen.

Spero: That’s a good idea. Can I wear like a pantaloon?

Sara: Yeah!

Spero: Alright… Oh my God, I just agreed to go to the water park… What’s the next question? Sorry Bobby.

Bobby: Ah, no worries, no worries. On the new record, there’s also many references to horses. You mention it in your bio; you have it in the Three Amigos, on Mother May I. Why the horses?

Spero: It’s funny that you mention that. We like to say it’s our most horseish album that we’ve ever made. We don’t know. We went with kind of a south western theme, we’re not sure why, that’s just kind of the vibe we were picking up from the universe. If you walk over to our merch table, you’ll notice there’s a lot of south western stuff. We have some horse shoes and some bandannas and stuff like that. We just kept being inspired by the west, that’s just what kept coming up and we don’t really know why. We’ve asked ourselves the same question. We said “wow, a lot of horses on this album aren’t there?” and there are.

Bobby: There’s no real explanation why.

Spero: There’s no real explanation, we just got inspired. Good question though.

Bobby: Do you think the fact that you all knew each other way back in junior high helped shape the style of the band? Do you think that while you write the songs you already know what the other band members would like or dislike because you guys have known each other for so long?

Spero: I don’t know. Let me think about it for a minute. Like this album is a real step forward for us in terms as song writing and our style and I think we all really surprised each with things that we were bringing to the table. In general, I think that… You know, I love working with these girls because we’re really supportive of one another and it’s really nice to bring something and have the other ones go “oh, this is really good, I love it.” It makes me feel so much more confident about it. But I don’t really know what they’re gonna like or what they’re not gonna like. It’s hard to say and especially with this album since we were all over the map. We were singing, we were rapping, we were playing instruments. I think we really all surprised each other and that’s what made it fun. I hope that we keep doing that, I hope that it continues. If it starts to get to a point where I know exactly what Sprout’s gonna walk in with or I know what Hesta Prynn’s gonna write, then that’s not going to be fun. But like the Three Amigos is a great example. I kind of started that song and I brought it in and was like “This is what I’m thinking: it’s a western song, it has a western theme, this is the first verse I wrote.” I was like “what do you think?” and they were so surprised “are you serious? You really think we should do a western song?” I was like “let’s do it” and great, they went off, wrote their parts and really embraced it. I love what they wrote on that song. So yeah, I think we keep surprising each other which is good.

Bobby: Do you think you guys could still be in this band together if you weren’t as good friends as you are?

Spero: No, I don’t think we could. I think it’s been a real struggle. We’ve had a lot of really hard times and we’ve never made very much money from being in this band, we’ve barely made any money from being in this band. I definitely think that if we weren’t such good friends we would not still be doing it because I think one of the biggest rewards we’ve been getting from this band is the fun because we haven’t been really making much money, we’ve been rewarded in terms of having fun and I don’t think we’d have as much as fun if we weren’t the friends that we are. We had the drive yesterday, we drove from Kelowna to Calgary and it was just such a great drive, like we had so much fun driving through the Rockies. We have never been to this part of the world before and we had such a good time in the van, we were laughing all the time, singing all the time; I just can’t imagine doing this with anyone else; I don’t think I could do this with anyone else. So I think the friendship is a really important part of it.

Bobby: But also being such good friends and knowing each other for so long do you know the exact points to pick at to really annoy one another too?

Spero: Kind of, yeah. I think that’s the flipside. The hard thing about being such good friends is that it’s a lot. We’re best friends, we’re business partners and we’re band mates. The business partners and the band mates are different roles too. Because we’re different people in the band when we’re playing music or writing music then we are in a business meeting where the three of us are trying to figure stuff out, and we’re different in the friendship. So that’s a little bit tricky, and that’s the only downside that, yeah, we can get under each other’s skin. It can get really hard like if we’re annoyed with something in the business, it can effect what happens in the band. Or if we’re annoyed with something in the band it could affect something in our friendship; so that’s the trickiest part. We do get on each other’s nerves and we do bicker and fight but we try. I think one of the best things that we’ve gotten good at in the last few years is like if we have an argument about the merchandise or something, when it’s done, we just leave it. We try to be on good terms again in the next five minutes and we can kind of try to move on in the next thing and just let it go. That’s a really important skill that I’m really proud of us for because I think that in the beginning we would get much more upset and we would hold onto the hurt feelings. But you can’t do that. It’s just business, it’s just t-shirts, whatever thing that we’re arguing about, it’s just a little thing that we’re just not seeing eye to eye on, it doesn’t mean that we’re not great friends.

Bobby: And you can’t really hold a grudge when you’re together for so long.

Spero: You can’t! You’ll make yourself sick. So I think we’ve gotten a lot better at that for sure.

Bobby: Okay, just a few more questions. First off, I love going to concerts, I try to go to as many as I can; but of course there’s some that are a bit more memorable than others. So thinking back, what are some concerts that you went to or played at that were really memorable for you?

Spero: Well, one of the most memorable things that we ever played at was the festival that I mentioned to you before. It was the Voodoo Festival in New Orleans the year before Hurricane Katrina and that’s the festival where the Beastie Boys were headlining and they were playing the main stage with Green Day and the Pixies and De La Soul was playing that festival and Cypress Hill. It was just like a combination of all the best bands that we loved growing up and we were playing the festival that day and we just felt so excited that day. That was so much fun for us, that was when we hung out with Adrock. And one of the most memorable things that we ever went to… *laughs* The first thing that’s coming to mind but I don’t think it’s memorable in a good way is that Sprout and I went to Lollapalooza. I think it was 1993 on Randall Island which is in New York City, like this little island, and it rained and poured the entire day and we stayed through the whole thing until the end because we wanted to see the Beastie Boys. So that was very memorable but they were great so it was worth it.

Bobby: That happened to me. We went to Vancouver during May Long for the Virgin Festival and it just poured and it was so cold. But we had fun, we drove fourteen hours to get there, we’re gonna stay through it.

Spero: Yeah, you have to have fun. Once you’ve put in that much time, you have to have fun. Totally.

Bobby: One more question, when you were growing up, whose poster did you have on your wall?

Spero: Okay, well when I was like seven, I had Duran Duran on my wall and I would kiss them like every night and I also had Bruce Springsteen. I think when I was older I had Joni Mitchell and Tori Amos and people like that; but when I was young it was all about Duran Duran and Bruce Springsteen; that was it. I loved them.

Bobby: Okay, I guess that’s about it. Thanks a lot. Do you have any final thoughts you’d like to add?

Spero: No, that’s it. You’re gonna stay for the show right?

Bobby: Yeah, yeah.

Spero: Cool, just that I hope you enjoy the show.